Complaints

• Initial Complaint

  07/05/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  On 28 April 2022 I attended this business, looking for equipment to record telephone interviews. I was told I needed a RecorderGear TR600 Phone Call Recorder, price Can$ 329.99, and TRX20 KGB "record coupler," price Can$49.99 (which I assumed was to connect the TR600 to a phone), plus cables. I purchased both, but subsequently was unable to set up the TR600 and get it to record. I then connected the TRX20 and found that it not only worked, but actually did the same thing as the TR600, for roughly 1/10 the price! In short, I needn't have bought the TR600 at all. I felt I had been scammed into buying an expensive item, when a far cheaper one would do the same thing. I phoned and said I wanted to keep the TRX20 but return the TR600 and get my money back. I was told to come in, and drove two hours from my home to the shop to return the item. On arrival, the salesman spent nearly a half hour drowning me out and jabbering. He hooked up the TR600 and said it worked. He then refused a refund on grounds that the cardboard box for the TRX20 (which I was NOT returning) was missing, along with a small cable, and there was a coffee stain on the TR600 instruction book. I asked if I found the cardboard box and extra cable and brought them in, would I get a refund? He said no, as the coffee stain on a page of the instruction booklet was still there. I feel I have been flim-flammed into buying a very expensive and difficult to use recording tool, when a far cheaper one--sold to me as a "coupler"--was itself actually a recorder and did the same thing. I'd like my money back on the TR600. *** **** *** ************ ***** ****** * *********** *********** **** ***** *** ***** ***** ****** ******* *** ***** 

  Business response

  07/05/2022

  Hello,
  

  Unfortunately this customer has decided to purposely omit some very important details. The customer contacted us in March in regards to ordering a recording device for his telephone , we informed the customer that it was not a common product that we sell but we're willing to assist them in attempting to locate the item they were looking for. Our sales staff provided the customer with a list of products for them to choose from and the customer provided us with his choice of the items he wanted. One of which being the recording device in question, the customer selected this product from the list of items that we had supplied was informed multiple times that the product was a custom ordered item and therefore would be able to be returned unless the item was defective. The customer agreed during the sales call, and this can be provided to you as all of our calls are recorded for quality assurance purposes. The customer then contacted us at the beginning of this week in regards to having issues with installing the device, we offered to assist the customer with setting up the item however they refused and told us that they were going to just keep the item and figure it out themselves, which again we can provide the audio recordings. The customer then chose to bring the item to our location to attempt to have a refund, even after they were again reminded that the product could not be returned unless it was defective but we were willing to assist them in setting it up or testing it. The customer at first refused to allow us to test it as they just wanted a refund without us checking the product first as he didnt have time, we then informed him that that is not our policy that we would have to inspect the item first as per the rules listed on the the invoice. During this time we plugged it in and it worked without any issues, changes or requirements within 30 seconds. This was shown to the customer and proved the device was working and the issue was that they needed to be provided some instructions or assistance on how to use the recorder , the customer again refused to accept that we are unable to return the item and was again reminded that he was informed the product was non returnable as was the agreement originally. During this time the customer became both belligerent and violent and chose to slam their fists on our fronto shout again, during this time he began to use foul language towards the staff member assisting him and chose to call the staff ********** *** ********, our staff was still very courteous with him even with his violent outburst , aggressive behavior and his aggressive fist pounding on our receptionist desk.  We eventually asked him to leave and not return as the staff were uncomfortable him. If the customer would like a reminder of their conduct have both the audio recordings over the phone, as well where he agreed that the item was not returnable on ordering and the video recordings of his violent acts and language. In short as the devices both fully functional, the customer was informed at time of purchase that it was a non-returnable unless defective in which they agreed, our staff were willing to attempt to assist him , he was missing parts of the product , the manual was damaged by the customer we are very limited and what we can do.   As you will note with the attached invoice,  the agreement clearly states that all items including packaging must be with the product to return as well as the manuals and must be in original condition. The customer has a fully-working device but refuses to allow us to show them how to use it.    Here is our requested result , the customer will privately apologize either by phone or email to both the staff present whom he scared with his conduct and our COO who he verbally assaulted, (who even with this was still trying to help)  The item cannot be returned as 3 conditions precluded it : 1) the customer was informed and agreed at the time of ordering the device was not returnable unless defective (which was proved as working on 05-07 2.) The device was missing cables/components 3.) The device was missing the packaging 4.) The provided instruction manual was damaged by the customer .  We are still willing to help the customer plug the device in, but the customer has been banned from entering any of our retail locations, and is flagged from future purchasing with us.  However once the customer supports with attaching the device is completed with our technician , the customer must agree additionally to no longer contact us again in the future and we recommend they do not conduct themselves in the same manor to other individuals or retailers.

  Customer response

  07/05/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  The response fails to acknowledge that the customer was deliberately sold two separate products, one at a high and the other at a modest cost, which duplicated each others’ basic function, and that hence the more expensive product was not needed at all. He had thought that the modestly priced “coupler” product (TRX20) was only an accessory for connecting (coupling) the expensive product (TR600) to a telephone, when in fact it could by itself have performed the basic recording function of the TR600, at far less cost. This is the core issue.
  
  As for the “missing multiple cables” and “packing material,” the item was returned within its original box, with what the customer believed were all its parts, including cables. He nevertheless offered to search further for any missing items and bring them in, even though this would require a two-hour drive from his home, with resulting gasoline expense. However, he was told that it would make no difference. A refund would still be refused. As for the coffee stain on the booklet, this was mentioned in the customer’s original BBB complaint. The manufacturer could have easily replaced it, likely free of charge to the retailer, with a new one to be resold with the TR600.
  
  Most importantly, however, the response appears to ignore the “Return Policy” clearly and prominently printed on the original Cando invoice (included with original BBB complaint), which states that items can be returned for refund “within 14 days of your original purchase date,” and in “good resellable condition,” adding that “physically damaged products will not be accepted for return or warranty.”
  
  As the Cando Sales person stated, and claimed to verify at the time of return, the TR600 was supposedly in good condition, and it was being returned within the 14-day limit. It was inside the original box, with what the customer believed were all its parts, and, as mentioned, the customer volunteered to bring in any missing materials. A refund was still refused. This was a clear violation of the company’s own printed policy.
  
  If bringing the expensive product back after being opened was somehow not acceptable, this would have made it impossible for any customer to test or try to use the product(s) in question, and thus discover whether it/they worked, or–in this customer’s case--that the more expensive one was not needed. The Return Policy makes no mention of any such packaging requirement. It does not say “returned UNOPENED in the original packaging,” only “returned.”    
  
  The response also makes no mention of the fact that the sales person kept up a steady, rapid stream of talk, preventing the customer from getting a word in edgewise, and ignoring his protestations and request to “listen to me.” As this constant, rapid jabber, along with the refusal to honor the Return Policy printed on the invoice, was quite annoying, the customer became impatient, and slapped the counter with his hand, saying “listen.” This was hardly “violence.”
  
  Finally, after failing to secure a refund, and with the sales person still jabbering at him, he left the store, and–here he was admittedly in error–swore as he left. He had, after all, been forced, in violation of the store’s printed Return Policy, to keep an unneeded $329.99 product, after a two-hour trip to the store, and listening to a protracted monologue from the sales person which ignored his protests and made it difficult to speak. For making his own parting remark, he does apologize.
  
  Nevertheless, an impatient expletive should not retrospectively violate the Return Policy. Nor should it excuse what appeared, on the surface at least, to be a “scam,” selling the customer something at high expense, which he did not really need. The customer is 80 years old, living on a very restricted income, and can ill afford such needless expenses. He believes the complaint is justified, and a refund is due.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****** *******

  Business response

  11/05/2022

  Hello,

  As per our telephone conversation , we believe as you do the customer is unfortunately in the wrong.  There is nothing further we can do to assist this customer as we have provided the audio recordings of the customer acknowledging the sales agreement with our CSR that the product was non-refundable due to it being a custom order.  The remaining details are below,  as the product functions as describe the customer can choose to sell it if they choose to do so. We have spoken with the wholesale supplier and they have stated they would not return it without the manual either and they do not have manuals for these products for replacement.  The customer needs to understand there conduct was unacceptable and has earned them a liftetime ban from any of our establishments.  As we had informed them the first time they left our location after the incident, they still chose to return to our location after us expressing they were not to return. It is clear the customer has chosen not to listen to any information or instructions provided in any situation.
  

   

  Unfortunately this customer has decided to purposely omit some very
  important details. The customer contacted us in March in regards to
  ordering a recording device for his telephone , we informed the customer
  that it was not a common product that we sell but we're willing to
  assist them in attempting to locate the item they were looking for. Our
  sales staff provided the customer with a list of products for them to
  choose from and the customer provided us with his choice of the items he
  wanted. One of which being the recording device in question, the
  customer selected this product from the list of items that we had
  supplied was informed multiple times that the product was a custom
  ordered item and therefore would be able to be returned unless the item
  was defective. The customer agreed during the sales call, and this can
  be provided to you as all of our calls are recorded for quality
  assurance purposes. The customer then contacted us at the beginning of
  this week in regards to having issues with installing the device, we
  offered to assist the customer with setting up the item however they
  refused and told us that they were going to just keep the item and
  figure it out themselves, which again we can provide the audio
  recordings. The customer then chose to bring the item to our location to
  attempt to have a refund, even after they were again reminded that the
  product could not be returned unless it was defective but we were
  willing to assist them in setting it up or testing it. The customer at
  first refused to allow us to test it as they just wanted a refund
  without us checking the product first as he didnt have time, we then
  informed him that that is not our policy that we would have to inspect
  the item first as per the rules listed on the the invoice. During this
  time we plugged it in and it worked without any issues, changes or
  requirements within 30 seconds. This was shown to the customer and
  proved the device was working and the issue was that they needed to be
  provided some instructions or assistance on how to use the recorder ,
  the customer again refused to accept that we are unable to return the
  item and was again reminded that he was informed the product was non
  returnable as was the agreement originally. During this time the
  customer became both belligerent and violent and chose to slam their
  fists on our front desk scaring our receptionist, and causing items to
  fall off. We calmly informed them were still willing to help the
  customer but he would have to calm down. He demanded we refund the item,
  we informed them that we could contact the supplier and see if there
  was a way to complete the return, however  while inspecting the product
  the sales member discovered the customer was missing multiple cables, as
  well as the packing material and the instruction manual had been
  completely damaged by what appears to be coffee. The pages had coffee
  stains throughout and had stuck together. We then informed him that's
  due to the fact additionally we could not return the product. Again the
  item was fully functional (as we had shown him). The customer continued
  to be aggressive and began to shout again, during this time he began to
  use foul language towards the staff member assisting him and chose to
  **** *** ***** ********** *** ********, our staff was still very
  courteous with him even with his violent outburst , aggressive behavior
  and his aggressive fist pounding on our receptionist desk.  We
  eventually asked him to leave and not return as the staff were
  uncomfortable him. If the customer would like a reminder of their
  conduct have both the audio recordings over the phone, as well where he
  agreed that the item was not returnable on ordering and the video
  recordings of his violent acts and language. In short as the devices
  both fully functional, the customer was informed at time of purchase
  that it was a non-returnable unless defective in which they agreed, our
  staff were willing to attempt to assist him , he was missing parts of
  the product , the manual was damaged by the customer we are very limited
  and what we can do.   As you will note with the attached invoice,  the
  agreement clearly states that all items including packaging must be with
  the product to return as well as the manuals and must be in original
  condition. The customer has a fully-working device but refuses to allow
  us to show them how to use it.    Here is our requested result , the
  customer will privately apologize either by phone or email to both the
  staff present whom he scared with his conduct and our COO who he
  verbally assaulted, (who even with this was still trying to help)  The
  item cannot be returned as 3 conditions precluded it : 1) the customer
  was informed and agreed at the time of ordering the device was not
  returnable unless defective (which was proved as working on 05-07 2.)
  The device was missing cables/components 3.) The device was missing the
  packaging 4.) The provided instruction manual was damaged by the
  customer .  We are still willing to help the customer plug the device
  in, but the customer has been banned from entering any of our retail
  locations, and is flagged from future purchasing with us.  However once
  the customer supports with attaching the device is completed with our
  technician , the customer must agree additionally to no longer contact
  us again in the future and we recommend they do not conduct themselves
  in the same manor to other individuals or retailers.

  Customer response

  12/05/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because: This response consists chiefly of repetitions of the ***** ***** ********* *******’s earlier statement. However, there are some newer points, which require comment.
  
  ** *** ****** *** *** *** ********* ************* ** ******* ** *** ** **** *** ******** ** ** *** *******
  **** ***** **** ** ** * ***** **** * *** ************** **** **** ***** *** ****** ********* ** ******* ************ ***** ******** **** *** **** ****** **** *** ************** ******* ********** *** ***** ** ***** ***** ** *** ****** ** *** **** ***** ****** ** **** ** *** ** ** ****** ********* *** ***** ****** ** ******* ************ **** *** *********** ****** **** **** ********
  
  2) The Cando spokesperson refers to “audio recordings” provided to BBB, which have not been provided to the plaintiff. These recordings should be provided to all parties, so that claims regarding them can be addressed by both sides. It should also be noted that surreptitious recording of supposedly private conversations, without informing all parties that recording is taking place, may violate privacy laws.   
  
  3) The Cando representative refers to the Return Policy, printed on the sales invoice, which states that items can be returned “within 14 days” if “in good condition.” The item was returned within the time limit, and the Cando rep himself confirmed by testing that it was in good working order. To then do an about-face and claim that being in working order actually constituted a reason not to refund contradicts this printed policy.
  
  Also, as per the Policy, it was returned  “in the original packaging,” namely the cardboard box it came in, and “with all material.” His claim that some cable was missing appears incorrect, as all of the cables and parts that came with the item were in the box at time of return. The Cando rep at one point referred to a second cardboard box. However, the only box other than the original one for the TR600 appears to be that holding the less expensive TRX-20 recorder, which the customer is keeping and did not wish to return.  The Cando rep should list the contents of the original box, and state which item was supposedly missing. The buyer believes all parts were in the box on return. If something was missing, the buyer has volunteered to bring it in.
  
  As for “in original condition,” the policy does not state that items must be returned “unopened,” which would be impossible if a buyer wished to examine an item and test it before returning. This would logically be required by Cando’s own Return Policy, if the buyer was to test it to find it “defective.” Obviously, to open for testing, any plastic film would have to be pierced.
  
  The only remaining item would thus be the instruction book, with a coffee stain (not “completely damaged, with coffee stains throughout”). It seems unlikely the original wholesaler or manufacturer would not be able to supply a replacement, after which Cando could offer the item for resale. A coffee stain should not be worth $329.99, plus tax!
  
  4) Finally, the Cando rep repeatedly refers to customer “violence” and “slamming fists.” This appears an exaggeration. During the entire return attempt, the Cando rep kept up a constant stream of chatter, not letting the customer get a word in edgewise. This became irritating, and the customer slapped the counter and said “will you **** ** and listen!” He does not recall anything falling or any terrified staff. The customer is 80 years old, white haired, stooped, and suffers from a debilitating neuralgia. He is unlikely to “terrify” anyone!. On leaving, after being handed back the item and told there would be no refund, and with the Cando rep still continuing his constant chatter, the customer lost patience and swore. For this, he apologizes.
  
  The customer believes Cando should honor its own printed Return Policy and refund the money.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****** *******

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩