Complaints

• Initial Complaint

  07/05/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Product Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  I HAD PROPANE SERVICE/DELIVERY WITH SCHAGRIN. I CHANGED MY HVAC IN FEB 2022 TO ELECTRIC/HEAT PUMP SYSTEM AND CUT OFF ALL PROPANE. I CONTACTED SCHAGRIN BEFORE I HAD THIS DONE TO ASK WHAT NEEDED TO BE DONE, COSTS, ETC. THEY TOLD ME THAT THEY DID NOT DO TANK REMOVALS IN THE WINTER, CALL BACK IN SPRING, BUT THAT THE COSTS WOULD BE BETWEEN $600-1,000.00 FOR A TANK REMOVAL, OR IF THEY DETERMINED TO ABANDON THE TANK, THERE WOULD BE A PUMP-OUT FEE, $.50/GALLON. I HAVE AN EMAIL FROM THEM WITH THAT IN WRITING. I HAD A DELIVERY SHORTLY BEFORE MY HEAT PUMP WAS INSTALLED AT THE BEGINNING OF FEB 2022 AND I WAS TOLD WHEN THEY CALCULATED THE AMOUNT THAT WAS PUMPED OUT, LESS THE .50/GAL FEE THEY WOULD REFUND THE BALANCE. THEY COMPLETED THE PUMP OUT JUNE 7, 2022. I CALLED AFTER TO ASK HOW MUCH MY REFUND WAS AND WHEN I WOULD RECEIVE IT. THEY DID NOT HAVE IT IN SYSTEM YET, DIDN'T KNOW. CALL BACK. I CALLED TODAY, 7/5/22 AND THEY TOLD ME THEY CHARGED A FEE FOR THE ABANDONMENT, WHICH IN THE EMAIL I HAVE AND IN THE MANY PHONE CALLS, THIS WAS NEVER DISCLOSED, AND THEY WERE KEEPING MY MONEY, AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN TELL ME. THEY WERE JUST SNEAKILY HOPING I WOULD FORGET THE MONEY I WAS OWED BACK AND TAKE IT FROM ME. THIS IS SUPER SHADY ON THEIR PART. HOW MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE THEY PULLED THIS ON? I SEE A PRIOR COMPLAINT ALREADY SIMILAR. I HAVE MY EMAIL SAVED FROM Wed, Feb 2, 2022 4:02 pm. MY REFUND SHOULD BE APPROXIMATELY $278.+ I HAVE UPLOADED TO BBB THE EMAIL I RECEIVED.

  

  Business response

  07/06/2022

  Schagrin Gas appreciates the former customer bringing this to our attention so we can address and resolve her concerns.  We confirm that the customer reached out to us in February 2022 notifying us of her request to have the tank removed since she had converted to an electric/heat pump system. Schagrin typically removes tanks in the Spring-Fall seasons, so it was advised to have the tank removed in the Spring/Summer. Schagrin’s termination costs are based on time and material with an underground tank removal or abandonment.  Those fees do vary based on the amount of time our technicians are onsite, so we do offer an estimated cost range stated by the customer.  As demonstrated in a portion of their signed gas service agreement:
  

  “The Company is authorized upon expiration or termination of this Agreement for any reason to enter upon any premises, with or without legal process, where the Service Equipment may be found, and take possession of and remove the Service Equipment at Customer’s cost on a time and materials
  basis (see Section G). Company shall not be responsible for any damages to sod, sidewalks or driveways while removal of the tank and/or equipment is underway. Company and its agent will exercise due care to keep damaged to the grounds to a minimum. Company will credit Customer for any gas remaining in the tank or tanks at the expiration or termination of this Agreement at the rate for Customer's category that was current at the time of lastdelivery.”
  

  This is further demonstrated in the email Schagrin Gas sent the customer and customer attached in their complaint:
  

  “We are in receipt of your request to remove the tank. We typically do not remove tanks in the winter time. I will speak with our service manager about your fence concerns and put in a work order to check the tank for removal or possible abandonment. They will contact you in the spring to advise when they will be out to survey the tank. In the meantime, the tank is on will call so no further deliveries will be made. As far as the removal, we would need to pump out the tank whether we remove or abandon it. The charges are based on time and materials for removal or abandonment and pump out fee is $.50/gallon. If you have any questions, please reply to this email. Thank you.”
  

  Regardless of whether the tank is removed or abandoned, a pump out fee will apply if the tank is above a certain percentage since additional time and material and often an additional day are needed to do this necessary safety step. We apologize if they misunderstood, but a removal or abandonment may have a pump out fee in every circumstance. 
  

  Our two technicians were onsite a total of four hours and 10 minutes from multiple visits to complete the necessary work.  Rather than charge our normal rates for two technicians to be onsite to perform gas work, in an effort to provide customer satisfaction to a loyal customer, Schagrin charged a reduced labor fee to complete this work and close the account with no additional monies owed to us.  Schagrin does confirm in February our pump out fee was $0.50 per gallon.  In May 2022 our current pump out fee at that time was $0.75 per gallon.
  

  If after all costs associated to the removal/abandonment are applied, along with all credits for any propane in the tank at time of removal/abandonment and a credit on the account still exists, the credit balance is refunded to the customer.  If a balance is owed, a final invoice is billed.
  

  Schagrin knows of no such email or phone conversation, including the email attached in the complaint, that was had between the company and the customer where it was stated that no tank abandonment fee would apply.
  

  Schagrin Gas would never intentionally forget the money a customer was owed back and take it from the customer. Our 90-year reputation as a family-owned business, we hope demonstrates our integrity.
  

  In an effort to provide the former customer additional customer satisfaction, Schagrin will honor the pump out fee rate quoted to the customer in February 2022.  We apologize this was not properly honored and credited to the account during the termination process.  Also, with the customer’s approval, we will issue this $25.00 as a refund check mailed directly to the customer rather than a credit on the account that could be applied towards other services we offer our customers, besides propane.
  

  It is our hope this will resolve the matter amicably with both parties.

  Customer response

  07/12/2022

  Better Business Bureau:

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to my complaint and have determined that this does not resolve my  issue.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.

   

  "Our two technicians were onsite a total of four hours and 10 minutes from multiple visits to complete the necessary work.  Rather than charge our normal rates for two technicians to be onsite to perform gas work, " THE FIRST VISIT THEY CAME OUT AND SAID THEY COULD NOT FINISH BECAUSE SOMEONE SMELLED GAS AND CALLED THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, BUT WHEN I CALLED THE OFFICE TO ASK ABOUT RESCHEDULE, THEY SAID SOME EQUIPMENT BROKE AND THAT IS WHY THEY HAD TO COME BACK OUT.  SO IF THEY ARE CHARGING FOR MULTIPLE VISITS, THEN SOUNDS LIKE THEY ARE ALSO PADDING THOSE COSTS. TANK ABANDONMENT MEANS THEY PUMP OUT THE TANK, FILL IT WITH WATER AND TOOK OFF THE TOP/OPENING AND IT WAS COVERED WITH DIRT.  THAT IS WHAT THE .50/GAL CHARGE IS FOR.  WHAT AM I BEING CHARGED FOR AND WHY DURING MY MANY CALLS WAS THIS NOT DISCLOSED? 

  "Schagrin knows of no such email or phone conversation, including the email attached in the complaint, that was had between the company and the customer where it was stated that no tank abandonment fee would apply." THIS IS ALSO UNTRUE, AS I HAVE A PHONE MESSAGE BEFORE THE EMAIL THAT THEY WOULD GET BACK TO ME TO LET ME KNOW WHAT THE COST WAS FOR TANK ABANDONMENT, AS I CALLED AHEAD TO ASK ABOUT THE TANK, WHAT WAS TO BE DONE WITH IT, AND WHAT COSTS.  THE PHONE MESSAGE I STILL HAVE SAVED ONLY SAYS THEY WOULD GET BACK TO ME ON THE COST FOR TANK ABANDONMENT AND I DID NOT RECORD THE CALLS I HAD WITH THEM, BECAUSE I NEVER KNEW I NEEDED TO.  BUT THE SEVERAL PHONE CALLS I HAD, WHICH I HAVE CELL PHONE RECORDS THAT I DID HAVE MULTIPLE CALLS, THEY NEVER DISCLOSED ANY OTHER FEES, AND IT WAS QUITE CLEAR I WAS ASKING SPECIFICALLY ABOUT HOW MUCH I WOULD BE REFUNDED.  THERE WERE MULTIPLE OPPORTUNITIES FOR THEM TO DISCLOSE OTHER FEES, OTHER THAN THE PUMP OUT FEE.  THE PUMP OUT FEE WAS THE ONLY THING THEY DISCLOSED TO ME ON EVERY CALL.  

  THEY SHOULD NOT GET AWAY WITH STEALING MONEY FROM PEOPLE JUST BECAUSE IT COSTS A LOT OF TIME AND MONEY FOR PEOPLE TO FIGHT TO GET THEIR MONEY BACK.  YOU HAVE CLEARLY LIED, IT IS UNETHICAL BUSINESS PRACTICE AND I WILL BE SURE TO SHARE THIS EXPERIENCE WITH ANYONE.  I HAVE NEVER PAID LATE OR MISSED ANY PAYMENTS WITH SCHAGRIN IN THE 10 YEARS I WAS THEIR CUSTOMER.  I HAVE PAID THEM ON TIME, IN FULL, FOR 10 YEARS AND THIS IS HOW THEY TREAT A CUSTOMER.  

   

  **In order for the bureau to continue to assist you, you MUST provide your view on the matter or your complaint will be closed as answered.

   

  
  
  
  
  
  Regards,

  Complaint ID: 17525562

   

   

   

  

  Business response

  07/27/2022

  Our pump out fee is $0.50 per gallon.  This fee is assessed automatically to any tank abandonment and any removal where the tank is above 20%.  The time and material cost for abandonment is a separate charge and is assessed to the customer normally based on the amount of time our technicians are onsite based on our normal labor rates.  This exact labor fee will vary based on the amount of time our technicians are onsite. Our pump out fee is separate from our time and material rate as disclosed in the email that was attached to the BBB complaint from the customer.  Schagrin has already reduced the amount of the labor rate in an effort to provide the customer with satisfaction for their loyalty to us of 10 years and their good payment history prior to the complaint being filed with the BBB.

  Schagrin Gas will be issuing the credit as discussed in our previous reply to the customer.  A check will be mailed to the mailing address we have on file for the customer.
  

• Initial Complaint

  03/28/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Billing Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  At 9:15pm on Feb. 15, 2022, our neighbor texted us to ask if our fireplace or gas stove worked. It did not. We contacted the other neighbors on the street and they all had the same problem. I called the emergency number to explain the problem. When the technician called back, he said "we thought it would last thru the cold weather." First of all, that gives me the impression that there is no criteria for when the tanks are refilled, but it is "somebody's" arbitrary decision when to fill, or not fill, the gas tanks in a neighborhood. (At that time of night, it was 27o and our neighbor had a 3 week old baby in a house with no heat.) The technician looked up our development on his computer and said that we still had 1,000 gallons left. However, he did send someone out to check the tanks. The technician came out and was very, very nice, and after refilling the tanks, he went to every house to tell us that the gas was back. He also said that of the 3 tanks servicing our development, 2 were completely empty and the third was only 1/3 full. Obviously 1,000 gallons does not cover all 56 homes. An HOA board member has called and e-mailed ******* ******, the manager of Sussex County, several times, starting on February 19. Mr. Briggs finally called her back yesterday, more than a month after the event. Unfortunately she was not home and did not get the call, which means we are no farther along than before since he doesn't answer his e-mails and takes a month to return calls. We would like to know the criteria for when the decision is made to fill a tank. Does the Schagrin contract identify this criteria? As a resolution of this problem, and to hopefully not have this happen again, we would like to have the threshold of supply for our development raised above 1,000 gallons, preferably to 2,000 gallons or higher.

  

  Business response

  03/30/2022

  Schagrin Gas is more than willing to elaborate on our procedures to improve customer transparency.  We can confirm that a delivery occurred during the evening of February 15, 2022, after three customers reported appliances that run off propane not working.  The specific tanks that fueled these properties in the development were checked in person and it was determined that they were below the forecasted levels that would prompt a delivery.  These tanks only fuel specific properties and do not fuel the entire development and are only part of a propane network we have in Ellis Point development.  Please note that a delivery for these specific tanks was already on schedule for February 17, 2022.  Deliveries for this development and many others are based off a degree day program, using weather temperatures as the driving variable to determine when deliveries need to occur in conjunction with the usage history since account creation to provide an accurate delivery forecast and prevent what the customer experienced.  Deliveries usually will occur once forecasting determines the tanks are below 30-35%.  The Schagrin contract does not identify this criterion specifically.

  
  Unfortunately, and unexpectedly, the normal delivery scheduler that manages this development was not in the office for an extended period which may have affected the delivery scheduling at the time and is no longer a concern of Schagrin Gas.  Since the prior delivery in January, in retrospect, it is apparent that our forecasting was off due to colder than expected temperatures, and primarily, customer usage was higher for the lots that run off this network during that time than in prior years.  While the tank mentioned did have more than 1/3 remaining in it at the time, we have determined that the gas pressure from these gallons was not sufficient to handle the number of homes in that network.

  
  Our branch manager for this region has attempted to reach out to the HOA member more than one time thru the different numbers we had on file and left thru voicemail to discuss the situation and what we are actively doing to prevent this in the future. 

  
  Schagrin Gas sincerely apologizes for what the customer and others experienced on the evening of February 15, 2022.  The branch manager for this region will reach out to the original HOA member again today (March 30, 2022) to discuss any questions or concerns they may have.  All delivery thresholds will be reviewed and adjusted as necessary.  Also, to help prevent this issue in the future, Schagrin will be installing tank monitors in this development which will update us daily as to the tank percentages in all tanks so that the customer can have the peace of mind that we are taking additional steps to eliminate this issue in the future.  

  Customer response

  04/07/2022

  Better Business Bureau:

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to my complaint and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me. 

  Regards,

  Complaint ID: 16955333
  

   

   

   

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩