Complaints

• Initial Complaint

  11/11/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Sales and Advertising Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  I took an engine head from a 99 **** F-350 7.3L engine to JR ********************** Shop to get checked out on 10/25/2022. I provided new valve stem seals and new valve stems. I picked up the head on 11/4 and installed it on 11/5. The compression on the front and rear cylinders were zero and the two middle cylinders had low compression. I took the head back on 11/7 to get reworked. I picked up the reworked head on 11/8 and installed it on 11/9. The compression results were the same as before. The head is much worse than when I originally brought it to JR **********************. JR ********************** also milled the head; however, the picture they showed me of the first pass only showed milling on one side and not in the middle area where it was expected to be off. It appears that the head was not set up right on the milling machine. I suspect that the head did not need to get milled. The only reason to do this is to pad the bill. In addition, they charged me more than twice the amount I was originally quoted. I took the head back off the truck and took it to another machine shop. This shop found three bad guides and seats on three intake valves and two exhaust valves were too high. Five of the originally reworked valves were out of specification. The new machine shop did a vacuum test on all the valves after they reworked the valves and all tested good. Because of the poor workmanship by the JR ********************** Shop and all the times I had to remove the head, reinstall it on the engine and testing the head after installation, I am requesting a full refund of my money. This head weights over ******************************************************** addition, I ended up damaging two head gaskets as a result of so many removals and installations, which cost me an additional $65.

  Business response

  12/06/2022

  I appreciate the opportunity to explain. I have been a machinist since ****. I have worked for 2 companies that have since closed there businesses. The last one M&S company im **********. ** closed in ****. I purchased there equipment after being the shop ******* for 9 years. I then purchased a building and there equipment. I pride myself on doing the best job for my customers that I can. 

   

  I do make mistakes and I try to remedy any issue a customer may have with any work I preform. The cylinder head in question was brought to my business. 7.3 liter **** diesel, I cleaned and checked the head. All the valves were bad. The customer brought his own valves. I checked the valves guides with a precise no go gauge. All guides were in spec according to my gauge. I then preformed a valve job in grinding the valve seats to the correct angle and width for the valve seats. I also lapped all the valve seats into verify seal. 

   

  The head was checked with a ********* ground straight edge. The head was warped. The only way to verify a head to be in good condition is to check with a machinist straight egde. No other way is possible to check a head. You cannot use a board or a ********* square to check a head. A straight edge is fairly expensive. Mine that i use was $750 

   

  After milling the head it was recleaned and assembled. The height of each valve was checked and verified to spec. 

   

  Customer picked up the head. A few days later he called and said he had a problem. I informed him to bring the head in and I would check it and see if i can figure out what is wrong.

   

  The customer returned with the head. I took the head back apart and verified the valves were seating and making a good seal. I vacuum checked each cylinder. Also i observed That there was no sign of any head gasket seal. The head gasket when torqued probably leaves a design on the head that telks you that you had a good seal. On this head there was no such mark anywhere. It appeared the head had never been torqued to a block. Very odd in my many years of experience to see no head gasket impressions on a freshly milled head. 

   

  As far as the bill from another shop. The valve seat price is $3.99 for hardened valve seat which is not even a close price that i pay at wholesale prices. My cost for a hardened 7.3 liter valve seat is $11.99 each. So how is it that this other shop can sell a hardened valve seat at this price?

   

  The valve guide price was $4.29 which is more in line with a valve guide price.

  I do not believe that a hardened valve seats were installed in this head. Which means it will fail before very long of engine running.  I strive to ensure i provide a statisfactory service to all my customers. I bothers me deeply that a resolution was made prior to your involvement. I have been in business several years and I do not take advantage of customers and pad any bills to make more money. I have plenty of work and do not need to do such dishonest types of things. 

   

  I appreciate the opportunity to explain my side of the unfortunate event. 

  Customer response

  12/07/2022

   
  Complaint: 18384022
  
  I am rejecting this response because after I got the head back RJ Machine, I installed on my truck.  I used a new head gasket and torqued it to specifications; 65 ft-lbs using sequence A, 85 ft-lbs using sequence A, and 95 ft-lbs using sequence B.  I put new seals on the injectors before installing and installed the push rods and brackets.  I did a compression test using the glow plug holes.  Only one out of the four cylinders showed good compression.  I took the head back off and took it back to RJ Machine to have it checked.  I got the head back the next day and again installed the head using another new head gasket.  I got the same results as before.

  Frustrated, I took the head to ****** Motor in ********** to have them check it out.  The machinist took the head and did a vacuum test on each cycler while I was there.  One cylinder did not hold any vacuum (leaked bad) and two other cylinders also leaked but not as bad.  Only one cylinder would hold any vacuum at all.  I left the head with them to have it fixed.  When I picked it up, they repeated the vacuum test and the results were much better.  I re-installed the head on my truck using another new gasket.  I damaged the last gasket when I removed the head previously.  I did a compression test on the reworked head and got good results on all cylinders.  Therefore, there was definitely a difference between when I installed the head when I got it back from RJ Machine and when I got it back from *******************.

  When I initially removed the head, I was not getting any head gasket leakage with respect to oil, water, or air.  As a result, it seemed reasonable, that the head flatness was within specification.  I also had a machined steel bar that I used to check the head for flatness and everything look good.  I used a **** inch thick feeler gauge to ensure that the gauge would not go under the steel bar on any part of the head surface.  I would have liked to have had a discussion with RJ before the head was resurfaced to understand why he thought it was warped and to get my approval before he did the additional work.  The fact that he did it without asking was the troubling part.  

  Before I took the head to RJ Machine, I called the shop to get a quote for checking the valves.  I was told by **** that it would be around $90.  For what RJ charged me was higher that two other quotes that I had gotten.  If I had gotten a more representative quote from RJ Machine, I would have gone with a **************.  Therefore, I was misled from the start which to me is a deceptive business practice.  Not happy with this aspect of my relationship with RJ Machine.  

  I don't really understand why the initial work from RJ didn't go well.  I am sure RJ is a good machinist, but something didn't go right with this job.    All I know is that I got poor compression on the head after installation after I got the head back from RJ, both times and got good results after I got it reworked at *******************.  I installed the head and torqued down the bolts the same for all installations.  This head is heavy and hard to install on the engine while it is still in the truck.  I was frustrated and not happy that I had to remove and reinstall this head so many times and had to buy multiple head gaskets.  

  Because I was initially misquoted for what it would cost me to have the valves redone and the head was resurfaced without having a discussion/approval, I believe I should get some reimbursement.  

  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *************************

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